In this battle of the Nora's, I want you to consider both women as romantics and feminists. Create an argument that compares the two of them and their work. What makes them role models for supporting feminism and romance? Why are they good at what they do--why have they lasted so long (Roberts' is still writing best-selling books and Ephron's last film was "Julie & Julia" in 2009 before she passed away)? Consider, too, which woman you find yourself aligning your own ideals alongside (we've read the Roberts' series and background on her; we've read a bio on Ephron and watched 2 movies, "When Harry met Sally" and "You've got Mail") or do you think they are too similar to separate the two? Once you create your argument, add in an analysis of how you might be represented in pop culture, in other words, Roberts' is a novelist and Ephron was a screen writer/director, but both women have created identities in the world of pop culture as feminist romantics.
Be specific in your response. Use evidence--so readings, movies, experiences, etc.
Should be 400-500 words. Dialogue with one another.
Due by Wednesday, November 8, 2012 by 8:00 pm otherwise you will not receive credit, and you'll be considered absent.
**Do note that this is longer than a typical blog post.
Nora Ephron and Nora Roberts are both very similar; they are both romantics and feminist. They didn’t need to look at the scientific studies mentioned in The Interpersonal Power of Feminism: Is Feminism Good for Romantic Relationships? To realize that a person whether a male or female can have both romance in her life and be a feminist .
ReplyDeleteBoth of them have overall given a similar message to out pop culture. In our pop culture, we can still constantly see the “male gaze” we read about in film Theory, but they took a different path.
Ephron is a funny feminist, who created films with strong women that found love. In the two movies Harry met Sally and You Got Mail, we see two female charters that have a career, independent, and for the most part know what they want, but they fall in love. Ephron was more than a relationship romantic, she wanted to portray to her audience more than that, after her production of You Got Mail she told her class “be the heroine of your life, not the victim” (Leo prg12).
Nora Roberts takes her point a view with similar perspective, but in a different form. Nora writes novels because she believes it’s healthy. That there is nothing wrong with reading romantic novels. She mentions “Just because many women "like to read about emotions, doesn’t mean we don't have intellect…Why is it not healthy to believe in love? Why is it not valuable to write about strong, healthy women finding a strong, healthy relationship?"(Krug prg14).
They are both feminist and romantics,but in my opinion take different paths. Ephron is more about “high and low culture, romance and theory, fun and politics and cooking and money and bottom jokes and plastic surgery.”(colgan 12), and Roberts is more about embracing the love and women to be strong, she says “Weak, passive people don't make good characters”(Colgan prg 8). Roberts wants to embrace what women are, how strong we can be. In the vignette we been reading we can see how each of her characters are strong women, own willed, sexy (not just by looks, but by character). In Ephron we see more of feminist side, trying to balance more of theory’s, views into a fun way in a film.
Both these women have been successful in their careers because they both love romance, and know what to their audience seek. As Seidel mentions in Judge me by the Joy I bring, a person can’t simply go out write a romantic script/ novel and expect success, in order to be successful “you can only write your own fantasies” (Seidel 168). These women have been successful because there true to their writing, they are acting upon a passion and sharing it to the rest of the world.
I admire these women for changing rational values we still see allot in pop culture. It is quite a challenge to get into a dominating view of what pop culture standard are, and come in changing it with your own perspectives, and that is what those women’s did. I have no idea how I would impact pop culture the way they did, that’s why they are admirable.
Nora Roberts and Nora Ephron are similarly known for their books and movies that present a perfect combination of feminism and romance. Through their novels and films, the two have created countless female leads that are not only tough and ambitious, but also incredibly likable with strengths and quirkiness we as readers and viewers find incredibly entertaining. Take Sally Albright in When Harry Met Sally, one of Ephron’s most popular movies. Sally is a quirky woman with strange and amusing habits. Sally is so full of life, hilarious even when she’s crying her hardest and as viewers, it is impossible not to love her. This is something that I think is so important in the feminist-romantic genre of Roberts and Ephron. The women are strong, beautiful, but also incredibly kind, funny and genuinely enjoyable. Their characterization makes their feminist characteristics appealing, something that I think is difficult to create. When reading about and watching these characters, it is no wonder the male leads fall head over heels in love.
ReplyDeleteThis leads into another important aspect of these women’s work: their male leads. Royce Cameron, Joe Fox, Cullum Murdouch, Branson MacGuire and Harry Burns all have something in common: their absolute respect for the women they fall in love with. All of these men fall in love with women who have goals, ambitions, and set-in-stone manners of doing things. They fall in love with women who have their own unique identity and who refuse to fade into the background. The male leads created by the Noras are feminists themselves. They don’t try to hold their women back, or expect them to submit.
What makes feminism and romance coexist so peacefully in the works of Nora Roberts and Nora Ephron is that the male leads accept feminism without a second thought. As Alexandra said, Roberts and Ephron both acknowledge that men and women can be feminists, and through that shared ideal they then find lasting romance. There is no power struggle, no arguments over who has control, only an unspoken agreement of equality between the two. A model, I think, we need to try to create in the real world.
However, out of the two, Nora Ephron’s work presents a stronger case than Nora Roberts, simply because her characters are much more realistic. Although I’ve never met somebody exactly like Sally Albright or Kathleen Kelly, what is so important about Ephron’s characterization of the two is their realistic nature. They don’t always make the right decisions, they don’t always win (Sally endures a string of failed relationships, Kathleen loses her bookshop) but they still represent feminist women in their own right. Laura MacGregor and her cousins, on the other hand, are too perfect. They say the right thing a bit too often, and seem to always make perfect decisions. By presenting characters more akin to real-life feminists and independent women, Ephron creates a stronger argument than Roberts that a coexistence of feminism and romance is possible in real life where mistakes and flaws are everywhere. I think, similarly to Ephron, if I were to be a pop culture figure, I would try to create stories with characters that are more realistic, with real flaws and mistakes, rather than perfect, beautiful women.
Both Nora’s create similar stories in their productions. They both try create romantic story lines that always have a happily ever after. However, while they both end in nearly the same way I believe Roberts writes slightly more feministic than Ephron creates her characters. Like Alexandra says “Roberts wants to embrace what women are, how strong we can be.” I completely agree with Alexandra. Roberts writes strong female leads that have independent lives away from their men. While it appears that Ephron has strong characters the men effect every part of their lives. In You’ve got Mail Joe Fox ends Kathleen Kelly’s business. He takes away a big reason that she was so independent and yet she still falls in love with him in the end. Just like in When Harry Met Sally, Sally does everything with Harry. He becomes a part of every part of her life. However, with Roberts her characters always have their own independent lives away from the man. All three Laura, Gwen, and Julia have their own careers and are able to support themselves.
ReplyDeleteBut there is another major difference between the two. Roberts focuses heavily on the family while the family connections in Ephron’s stories are weak if non-existent. Roberts’ stories “Embody the values of the perfect family” (The official Nora Roberts Companion 300). The MacGreggors are a close-knit family. Even in Roberts other novels such as the Boonsboro inn trilogy or the Bridal quartet books there is a heavy emphasis on family. There are strong connections that could be categorized as romantic just by the way they find importance in one another. Ephron puts little emphasis on the family and major emphasis on the relationship between the man and woman in the story. Besides Kathleen Kelly’s mom there are very little connections in her movies.
While I do believe that Roberts presents more feministic characters I also believe that Ephron presents more realistic ones. Lexi claims that “Laura MacGregor and her cousins, on the other hand, are too perfect” I strongly agree with Lexi. Ephron’s characters are more relatable. It is very unlikely that a character like Laura, Gwen, or Julia actually exists. But they do embody a perfect feminist. Ephron creates characters that are not perfect and do have an opportunity to exist in real life. So while Roberts creates more feministic characters and emphasizes a strong connection with the family, Ephron creates more relatable ones.
Nora Roberts and Nora Ephron both create characters within their stories that embody an almost perfect combination of feminism and romance. Characters in each novel and film begin with strong, successful, independent women who incorporate love into their lives. I believe that both Nora’s have very similar ideals; they both want to create the perfect role model for women, a role model that has learned to balance the feminism and romance in her life in a way that is applicable to all women. And while both Nora’s give their characters generally the same stories, I think it is important to realize the realism of each type of character.
ReplyDeleteJordyn makes a good point in saying that Roberts’ novels have more feministic characters and she has a greater focus on the family. The characters of Laura, Gwen, and Julia are strong feminist characters that value their family before anything, and find love after making a life for themselves. But these three women have extremely unrealistic lives. It is hard to imagine that any woman can find an extremely attractive, built man, who has a fantastic job, and whose personality matches perfectly with the woman’s. Yes, it is nice and good to want to believe that this can happen to anyone, but everyone knows life does not always work out perfectly, like Roberts seems to suggest.
On the other hand, as Lexi said, Ephron’s characters have more realistic stories than Roberts. I agree with Lexi in this aspect completely. When Ephron gives her characters more realistic stories, it makes the films easier to relate to. Ephron creates better role models out of Sally and Kathleen because it is easy to see how their stories can be translated into any woman’s life. It is possible for any women to have a successful job and a relationship, but at the same time has many forms of conflict in their lives, that they must work through to have their happily ever after.
I find it easier and even more realistic to align my feminist and romantic ideals to Ephron's ideals. This is because her character’s lives are full of times of struggling and hurt, and they have to fix the problem only if it makes sense at the time to fix the problem. They must work to get their happy ending. Whereas Roberts’ characters have lives that works themselves out with very little struggle, and their happy ending seems to just magically happen.
Oh Norah, what you do to me dear!
ReplyDeleteIt is rare that a female popular culture writer makes a truly dominant, and everlasting, impact on the realm of media today. The stories of the heart, whether they are formatted as television shows, plays, movies, or novels, are predominantly produced, manufactured, and written by men. Men suck with their emotions. This sucks. Where is the ‘girl power’ in popular culture? Where is the feminine take on the stories of the heart?
Well, I recommend we look to Norah Roberts and Norah Ephron to satisfy this desperate desire. The Norahs have completed the truly daunting task of combing ideals of feminism and romance into complex, likeable characters. The Norahs’ characters allow audiences to digest the sometimes-daunting acts of feminism while quenching that omnipresent thirst for romance.
However, it is their male leads that have made these authors truly outstanding. In Norah Roberts’ The Macgregor Brides, Cullum, the to-be husband of Julia, is dangerously seductive and frustratingly stubborn. He is a hard male that seems immune to efforts to change him. However, he is only dangerous in his sex appeal; within the deepest reservoirs of his personality, he is respectful and appreciative of strong women. He can admit to himself that he needs something more than a one-dimensional blonde bimbo.
And this is why we love him, and consequently, Norah Roberts. In real life, men never seem to know what they want. Or they go after that one skank that you know he was never meant to be with. We know: YOU BELONG WITH ME. And what is so great about Roberts’ male characters? They know they want a smart, beautiful, weird, strong, and quirky woman. I mean, finally.
Norah Ephron appeals to this phenomenon too. In Harry Met Sally, Harry is a tough male character (not physically, I know). His wit and unrelenting cynicism seem daunting and arrogant, but these are the only dangerous qualities about him. Deep down, Harry is heartbroken from his divorce, and he is desperate for a little optimism. He finds that bubbly happiness in Sally, his true love. Harry is the one who admits his love for Sally first; he knows what he wants and isn’t too scared to go after it. And this is why the female audiences sigh hums of pure pleasure.
While both authors have created compelling stories, I relate much more the Norah Ephron because her main female leads are the underdogs. As Lexi mentioned, the female leads in Ephron’s movies don’t always win, while the females in Roberts’ novels seem to have everything put together. To steal Lexi’s examples, Sally has many failed romances and Kathleen does not get to keep her mother’s bookstore. Ephron’s characters are a little battered, but it is something more than this that truly draws me to her movies.
The characters in Ephron’s movies are one of kind- they could never be replicated in film or in real life. Their charm, spunk, and humor are intricately unique, and I think it is this characterization talent that makes audiences fall in love. I don’t want to be able to say that any of Ephron’s characters are exact replications of myself. Rather, I want to find comfort in the fact that none of her characters are like anyone I have ever encountered before. I want to be able to celebrate individuality, and Ephron gives me the avenue to do so.
If I were represented in popular culture, I would be a female lead in a Norah Ephron film (yes, I am giving myself way to much credit here. Shush.) I would be absolutely perfect to write for because
a) I am weird and awkward. I have that underdog charm. Hopefully.
b) I already have the PERFECT failed romance background. Are you ready? The boy I dated for a year and half in high school ended up dating a boy one month after we broke up, and is still with a boy today. Norah, I know you can do something with this.
I am writing my resume as we speak.
Between the two Noras, I feel as if they are both similar and one way is their success. The reason why they both are so successful is because they fully understand the interconnecting link between feminism and romance. Nora Roberts and Nora Ephron depict both feminism and romance in which they bring these qualities to life through the creation of their characters in either their romance novels or romantic comedies. Through their works, they are able to raise awareness that a girl is allowed to be herself and be romanced. Both have an important influence on popular culture for various generations of girls.
ReplyDeleteAs a novelist, Roberts intertwines romance and feminism into different personalities of her characters in the novels. The female characters demonstrate being independent, stand for their values, and still are romanced by the man they eventually realize they love. In The MacGregor Brides, all three of the leading female characters for each vignette represent their own version of what a woman is. They become uniquely appealing because of their feminist values. This is the interesting part as well, as Lexi similarly mentioned, that the men who fall in love with them fall for who they are and what their values are rooted in. Royce, Branson, and Cullumadore Laura, Gwen, and Julia when they are doing what they do best at their work. This is why Roberts is successful because she portrays the idea of how a woman can be herself, empowered, uniquely her own and still have a love life filled with romance. This defies the major stereotypes about feminists being “ single, lesbians, or unattractive” (Rudman et al 78). On the contrary, it was found that they “may improve relationships as opposed to undermining them” (Rudman et al 799). It’s the total opposite! There’s no need for change and that is what Roberts sends and reaches the younger generations of girls who read her novels.
Similarly, Ephron achieves the same level of success because of her understanding of and placing those qualities within her characters of the movies she has made. In the movie When Harry Met Sally, Sally’s personality and character is clearly seen as her own woman, a feminist who has her own beliefs which seem to always collide with those of Harry’s. When Harry finally realizes that he loves Sally, he also realizes that it is the eccentric and weird things that make her Sally that he loves about her. Likewise, this is the key to why Ephron is so successful because she raises awareness of the fact that men fall for a woman who is her own individual, by bringing them to life and played out on screen. This reaches out to many girls where they realize it is not true when they feel like there is only a certain type of girl that all guys like. Furthermore, it demonstrates that a girl does not have to change who she is (making her feminist) and will find someone who loves her for the person she is.
Both Noras portray the male character falling in love with a woman of her own. That they love them for who they really are, they don’t need to change and the fact that they embrace both feminism and their femininity is what makes them love them even more. The message that it sends out to girls is to just be themselves, they will be appreciated. However, out of the two, like Lexi and Aly, I believe that Ephron creates situations where they are more realistic and not as fictional. I think a girl watching an Ephron movie can relate it back to herself more while a girl reading one of Roberts’ novels would be more of an escape than relating.
As for myself, I feel like I would be represented in pop culture as a passionate individual, a feminist who still believes in romance as well because of the influences of women like Roberts and Ephron, I too have realized that I should just be myself. No need to change or look to become a different person just for the purpose of men. I feel like everyone’s lives can be turned into a story, and my story would hopefully portray myself as being happy. That’s really all I want.
Nora Ephron and Nora Roberts are both known for their unparalleled ability to craft the perfect love stories – ones with drama, romance, and the perfect amount of sexual tension. However, it must also be noted that the stories these women create also include strong elements of feminism, and that they in no way allow their characters to become submissive or oppressed in their relationships.
ReplyDeleteThe Noras are very similar in their feminist portrayal of female characters. No matter what novel or movie, the main character is always a woman who is strong and successful. Roberts’ characters Laura, Julia, and Gwen are all career women, and occupy positions that are stereotypically held by men – a doctor, a lawyer, and a renovator. Ephron’s characters are no different – Kathleen Kelly owns her own business (The Shoppe Around the Corner) and Sally is a successful journalist. And yet, while being strong, none of these women let their careers control their lives. As Lexi said, “The women are strong, beautiful, but also incredibly kind, funny and genuinely enjoyable. Their characterization makes their feminist characteristics appealing, something that I think is difficult to create.” By creating characters that are equal parts seriousness and sass, the Noras create a flawless combination of romance and feminism in each female lead.
However, I must disagree with Jordyn’s statement that Roberts’ characters are more feminist. While it’s true that in You’ve Got Mail Kathleen Kelly falls for Joe Fox despite what he’s done, I feel that this empowers her in a way rather than degrades her. Forgiveness in itself can be powerful simply because of the fact that she has made the decision to allow him back into her life; it is something that she does because she wants to, not because she feels that she has to. Furthermore, I agree with Lexi that Roberts characters are far too unrealistic. Laura, Gwen, and Julia are a trio that have never truly known hardship – they come from a family that is wealthy and powerful, which means that status is never an issue, and their stories unfold with little real conflict.
Personally, I feel that because Ephron creates more realistic characters, they are easier to relate to, and in turn it is easy to recognize their strength and independence. As a woman, I have experienced heartbreak just as Sally did in When Harry Met Sally – for me and many other women, this makes it simple to understand that she is a perseverant woman. As a person, I would rather be portrayed as Ephron’s characters are portrayed, simply because of the fact that I realize that life always comes with trials and tribulations. By overcoming these obstacles, Ephron’s characters are realistic examples of women’s everyday lives.
Overall, Nora Ephron and Nora Roberts are (and should be) recognized as some of the predominate romance writers of our society, but also as women who understood the importance of feminism in women’s everyday lives. Because of the characterization in these books and films, it is plain to see that these women were feminists as well as romantics.
In the battle of the Nora's my vote goes Nora Ephron...but mainly because I prefer watching movies over reading books. I grew up watching movies such as "You've Got Mail" and "Sleepless in Seattle" and now that I am older I can appreciate the strong female leads that Meg Ryan brings to life. Both the Nora's however capture feminism and romance within each of their female leads. I just happen to personally believe that Ephron balances feminism and romance within her movies better than Robert's does in her novel.
ReplyDeleteLike Lexi said and Lauren agreed Ephron does a better job of making her female characters and their lives more realistic. I feel that I can relate to the female characters in her movie much more than I could reading Robert's "The Macgregor Brides". Although some may find it far fetched I believe it has been seen in many cases that people can fall in love over the internet such as Meg Ryan and Tom Hanks did in "You've Got Mail". But ultimately what I loved more than the realistic plot of the film was Ryan's characters balance between her independent lifestyle and romantic life. It was also a relief to see that no matter where she was in her romantic life her passion for her work stayed the same. This was the quality I struggled to find in Robert's characters. Neither Laura, Gwen, or Julia seemed to balance their work and romance. Romance always seemed to conflict with their professional lives.
Jordyn and Lauren discussed that Robert's embodied strong feminist leads, but I disagree because although they may have started feminists I feel that by the end they were hopeless romantics. But to credit some to Robert's she does set up a good feminist foundation for each character. I feel that Robert's continues to attract readers because it is her characters professions that ground them and many women of recent generations can relate to that.
There may be people who disagree with me and believe that Ephron is unrealistic because her movies seem much like "fairytales". I happen to personally believe that people's lives can play out much similar to fairytales. In my own life I have questioned on occasions how realistic something is that happened to me. There are weird coincidental situations that happen to us in our lives and I think Ephron perfectly portrays those events. I leave my thoughts there with Ephron being the Nora that I best connect to, but Robert's not far behind.
Before I took this class, I would have said that though Nora Roberts’ became quite repetitive after the first few, they were still good examples of a balance between feminism and romance. However, after studying both concepts for a few weeks, I have decided that in my opinion, that no longer holds true, and the main reason relates back to exactly what both Lexi and Lauren were saying.
ReplyDeleteThe characters in Nora Roberts’ books know what they are going after in life, and how to get what they want. While they usually never fully understand the love in their life until the end of their book, their goals and ambitions, the very things that make them feminist, are fairly set in stone. They don’t struggle at all to keep their feminist ideals, even when love comes knocking at their door, making life look a little too easy. I think that Nora Roberts is trying too hard to keep a balance of feminism and romance. She knows that in order to keep women buying her books, her female characters have to be strong, and be a sort of role model for her readers. But as Lexi said, it is much harder for women to relate to Roberts’ characters, because even though they might not have their love lives figured out, they are “perfect” in almost every other aspect, and that is just not something that any of us can achieve.
Lauren agreed with this idea as well, saying that Ephron’s movie characters were much more believable, because they had concrete conflicts, as well as flaws. The fact that they struggled to retain their feminist and romantic ideals, but did indeed figure most of it out by the end, is what truly makes them good female role models. For example, in the movie You’ve Got Mail Kathleen Kelly becomes terribly confused about whether it is okay for her to fall in love with Joe Fox, when he is the reason that she lost every other aspect of her life. Would it be anti-feminist to give in? Could she still be a strong, independent woman if she fell for him? Ephron uses the plot to combine the issues of feminism and romance, whereas Roberts already has the feminist part figured out, and must only deal with the romantic aspect of life.
My ideals definitely tend to fall more in line with Ephron’s work, because I appreciate the way feminism and romance are always entangled in her movies. Because isn’t that the basis of what we have been learning in this class? For the past few weeks, we have been considering whether or not the two can coexist, or if perhaps there is any way for them not to. I believe that they are like yin and yang (kind of like the day of the dead and Cinco de Mayo) and that they are not only interrelated, but also dependent on the other. Roberts’ tries very hard to have an equal amount of feminism and romance, but they are too separate, and too unrealistic. As someone who has indeed attempt to write a novel that includes both feminism and romance, I desperately hope that I can do it the right way and perhaps become a role model in my own right, which in my opinion, means having a style that is much more similar to Nora Ephron’s, rather than Nora Roberts’.
Nora Roberts empowers women through her novels. Nora Ephron did it through the movies she directed and the articles and essays she wrote. Both of these women had similar views on feminism and romance. They knew, as we have learned throughout our class, that having both was achievable. These women’s legacies have lasted so long because of the systematic tales they tell; the empowerment of the woman, the effect she has on the man, along with the happy endings. People find comfort in these stories and “escape” into their fantasies.
ReplyDeleteI have found myself relating to Nora Ephron’s ideals more and more in comparison to Nora Roberts as each week has passed based on the her essay we read and how much I have enjoyed the movies she has directed. I agree with Lauren completely that in Ephron’s movies the females must work to get their happy ending, whereas Roberts’ characters have seemingly perfect lives without much, if any struggle. I personally want to read a novel or see a movie that I can relate to. I am not perfect, nor do I pretend to be. Although they are still fun to read, without flaws in the female characters I feel disconnected to the them in Roberts’ novels.
I also agree with Meg when she says that in Ephron’s works are more relatable because “forgiveness in itself can be powerful simply because of the fact that she has made the decision to allow him back into her life; it is something that she does because she wants to, not because she feels she has to”. I feel that the women in Ephron’s movies are more compassionate, more loving, and more forgiving compared to those in Roberts’ novels. Overall, I believe that the more relatable the characters are, the better feedback the author/director is going to receive, especially for an audience of women. For that reason, I side with Nora Ephron’s ideals for creating realistic women who have flaws but learn how to overcome them.
If I were to enter the world of pop culture I would love to be considered a role model who could show that no one woman can really “have it all” or be perfect. We all make mistakes and learn from them, and I would hope to show how I have overcome significant trials in my life. I would love to be one of Ephron’s characters who have inspired countless women in the past and will continue to for many decades.
Nora Ephron and Nora Roberts: Two feminist romantics that contradict the stereotypes of their works. Each offers feministic ideals and has become a hit.
ReplyDeleteThrough Phillips, we learned that there is an intricate technique to romance. As Alexandra states, Roberts knows what her audience is seeking and is extremely passionate. She is very successful because of this. Although a romance writer, Roberts’ feminist standpoints are portrayed in her strong female characters, Laura, Gwen, and Julia. All are healthy, smart, successful, independent women. Most importantly, they are not looking for men, but eventually fall in love, through the male’s determination and hard work. “Daniel wants his loved ones to have fine minds, independents spirits, challenging goals- and marriages filled with passion” (Little 3). Uniquely, Roberts expresses her love of family in her writing and presents the “perfect family” as the MacGregors (Little 2). Her fans love and are dedicated to her work, believing they, as well, have become a part of the MacGregor family.
Nora Ephron in “When Harry Met Sally” and “You’ve Got Mail” may present classic, “chick-flick,” unrealistic stories, but the women in each movie is smart, independent, strong, and monumental for modern American women. Like Roberts, Ephron has made major breakthroughs for women inside her work, but in a third-wave feminist manner. She goes against second-wave feminists by, “Reclaiming such terms as ‘chick’ and ‘girl’ “(Wood 1). Girl power is introduced and the reality of a working, successful woman is presented. “She broke barriers for women in Hollywood and elsewhere – while being the kind of model person that inspires others” (Wood 1).
I admire Roberts and Ephron both, as they go against pop culture norms and embody feministic attributes in their romantic-based work. I align my ideals with both authors, as they each appreciate and make gains for women with their female characters. Ephron may be looked upon as more of a third-wave feminist, but I believe Roberts’ presents third-wave ideals through her characters. As Julia is on a date with Todd, he sees her dress as an indication that she “wants some.” Julia responds that she liked the dress and that was all. Laura, Gwen, and Julia are very beautiful women that partake in fashion and looking good for only themselves. Unlike, Erin and Meg, I find Roberts and Ephrons’ intentions very entangled.
In pop culture, I would position myself as more of a novelist and writer, in pursuit of empowering and inspiring women. Separate from screen writing and book novels, the genre of a magazine would be very applicable, refreshing, and constructive for women. I would love to convince women that their worth goes beyond their looks and is also dependent on their minds. Being like Roberts’ and Ephrons’ characters (healthy, hard working, smart, go-getting, beautiful women) is an inspiration. I would want to reveal to women the real value and importance of those attributes.
Without a doubt Nora Roberts and Nora Ephron are two of the most important and well-known contributors in romance. The characters in the works of both women display a combination of both feminist and romantic qualities, showing that feminism and romance can coexist in the lives of women. Nora Robert’s novel The MacGregor Brides exemplifies three characters who balance feminism and romance beautifully. Laura is a self-assured lawyer who falls madly in love with Royce, but maintains her assertive behavior in the relationship. Gwen is a successful doctor with high expectations, and although she cannot resist the handsome and mysterious Branson McGuire, her job and family remain a priority. Laura is a woman who believes that the only opinions that matter are her own. She cannot resist Cullum Murdoch, but does her best to make sure their relationship plays by her rules. The three MacGregor cousins are feminist in every sense of the word, but also allow themselves to fall madly in love.
ReplyDeleteSimilarly, Nora Ephron’s female leads display feminist and romantic characteristics. In “When Harry Met Sally,” Sally has a successful career and is independent. She lives her life without a man, but when Harry admits he loves her, she realizes it is okay to love him back. In “You’ve Got Mail” Kathleen Kelly is also career driven and will fight as hard as she can to save “The Shop Around the Corner” from being closed by Fox Books. When she is forced to close the shop she does not give up. She balances this determination with her relationship with the man online. Sally and Kathleen are career driven independent women who allow themselves to enter into relationships without losing who they really are. They maintain their independence and self-respect even when they are in love.
Lexie brought up the important idea that Nora Ephron’s characters are more realistic or relatable than the characters in the MacGregor brides. The MacGregors are wealthy, beautiful, and successful. They run into small issues with the men they are dating, but nothing large enough to challenge the success of the relationship. Jordan says that Robert’s books are much more focused on family, and she is right, but I think the reliance on family makes the book less realistic. They get everything they need from their grandfather, which is not the way most women live their lives. They fall in love almost immediately, and their romances are nearly flawless. Laura, Gwen, and Julia represent the two opposite ends of the spectrum of feminism and romance. The MacGregor women are strong, but almost to the point where it is difficult to see any woman behaving in that way, and when they fall in love they fall head over heels with no hope of escape into perfect relationships with beautiful men who respect them.
In Ephron’s movies on the other hand, the female characters seem much more grounded. They work hard and do not need to be defined by the men in their life. By no means do they have their success handed to them. In “You’ve Got Mail” Kathleen loses her shop, her boyfriend, and very nearly her sanity, but proves her strength by making it through the struggles. Kathleen and Sally cannot rely on their grandfather and their family’s power to meet and keep their men, but rather have to work for the success of their relationships. They doubt themselves and doubt the men in their lives, but are ultimately able to trust in love. They fall in love over time and their relationships are by no means perfect, but they have the courage to make them work. Kathleen and Sally are quirky and unique and certainly make mistakes, but use their feminist qualities to persevere and ultimately succeed, making them more realistic than the Robert’s characters who seem untouchable.
Nora Robert’s characters are not necessarily more feminist than Nora Ephron’s characters, their feminist actions are just more blatant and outlined very clearly right of the bat. Both Noras successfully incorporate feminism and romance into their stories, and show that these two concepts can go hand in hand.
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ReplyDeleteIn the battle of the Nora’s, both leave victorious. They have accomplished what many hope to accomplish and that is inspire people. These two women have inspired the masses in different ways, but nonetheless the reader or person watching the movie leaves more enriched than when they started.
ReplyDeleteEphron has done this in many ways. First, she created “real” women for her movies. What I mean by this is she created women that deal with the same problems women around the world deal with. At the same time, she created feminist characters at the same time incorporating the romance. This is a tricky balance, but Ephron has perfected it. Aside from her movies, Ephron has claimed her stake as a role model. In the pdf we read A Few Words About Breasts, Ephron discusses how as an adolescent she struggled with dealing with having small breasts. She talks about all the things she did to increase her bosom size, but she explains sadly they never grew. This appeals to many women, specifically those with a small cup size. Ephron stays pretty light on the subject, but indirectly lets women know that it is impossible to control their breast size and that it’s not their fault if their bodies are not ideal.
Roberts could also be considered a role model through her characters in her romance novels. Specifically in the McGregor Brides, she writers about extremely powerful women like Laura a lawyer who is completely self-sufficient. At the same time, like Ephron, she is able to incorporate the romance flawlessly. Roberts in her own life has set herself as a role model because she is such a successful writer. Many women can look up to her because she has succeeded in a “man’s business”. This gives many women hope that they too can succeed in a “man’s world.”
Ephron has lasted so long due to her relatable characters. In the movie You’ve Got Mail, Kathleen is a small business owner who has had a hard time finding “the women”. Another reason Ephron has lasted so long is through her writing and directing. She has some of the best movies out there, embraced by both critics and viewers. This is not an easy feat.
Roberts has found her success through her balance of drama and reality. Her stories possess the perfect amount of excitement or thrill, but stays grounded in reality. Along with Ephron, Roberts is also able to create women that many real life women can relate to.
I find myself aligning my own ideals alongside Ephron mostly because I identify with her real world characters and charming wit. She allowed me to relate to her characters quickly and with ease.
If I were a pop culture, I would try to represent the idea that you can be YOU without worrying what anyone else thinks. In my life, having role models like Neil Patrick Harris has helped me immensely.
Nora Roberts and Ephron are actually extremely similar with how their ideals. They are both romantic and feminist at the same time. Robert’s female characters are all in search of love whether they are passively or actively looking for love. Plus, they gain “empowerment by seducing the dangerous male’ (Phillips). The ability women such as Laura, Julia and Gwen in the ‘MacGregor Brides’ have to seduce and control an uncontrollable and unpredictable man empowers all of the female characters. Meanwhile, Ephron’s movies are also romantic but they have a different feel to them. The women are also looking for love, whether that be passively or actively. However, the female characters in Ephron’s movies view love as an option rather than a priority at the beginning of the relationship. None of her women believe that their sole purpose is to find a man or be in love. For example, in ‘When Harry Met Sally’, Sally was still able to go through life and succeed in her ventures whether or not she had a man by her side. Although ending a relationship was heartbreak for her, she was still able to move on with her life and ambition. I actually believe that the two Nora’s are too similar to be placed into different categories.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Erin with how Roberts used books and literature to empower women while Ephron used films and cinema in order to do convey the same message. I also believe that I relate more to Ephron’s philosophy and ideals more so than Roberts’ because I relate more with the movies that Ephron has directed and the lead female characters she has as opposed to the female character in Roberts novels. The women in Ephron’s films are a lot more realistic because they aren’t too emotional or irrational and unrealistic like the characters in Roberts’ novels.
If I were to be represented in pop culture I would like to be represented by Ephron’s female leads in her movies. Her women are much more realistic than Roberts’ female characters. They have more realistic flaws, concerns and worries than most people.